Amy Vaughn:
Alright. Hello, everyone, and welcome to our weekly podcast. This is your place to hear authentic conversations from those who have power to share. My name is Amy Vaughn, and I am your host. And I’m so excited to have all of you here with us. If you wanna learn more about Together Digital, you can join the movement at together in digital.com. And today, we are very lucky to have Natasha with us. Natasha is a very new and now dear friend.
Amy Vaughn:
She is a true trailblazer and a 3 time founder who currently is leading the charge as CEO at Invisify Global Intelligence. Her journey is nothing short of inspiring. She has mastered behind is masterminding behind, a cutting edge platform that is revolutionizing how organizations understand cultural intelligence and customer behavior. And that’s just the tip of the iceberg, folks. She has 4 languages under her belt, with a global perspective that is second to none. Natasha has been the driving force behind data driven strategies for Fortune 500 Companies and government agencies alike. Her expertise spans global trends, emerging tech, and building high performance teams, making her a very sought after consultant for top brands worldwide. I’m excited to share that Natasha will also be a featured speaker.
Amy Vaughn:
Like I said, as soon as we got into conversation, I’m like, okay. We need to hang out more. She’s gonna be with us in 2 weeks, less than 2 weeks at our upcoming Illuminate National Conference, in Cincinnati on October 17th. We’re excited to see many of you listeners there, where she will be addressing a very critical topic of DEI and being under fire, where together we will be discussing and exploring how data can empower us and move us forward rather than retreat from diversity, equity, and inclusion efforts. And this is a very relevant subject matter, folks, as many of you in this space know and understand. And I think it’s a very unique perspective that Natasha has to share, so I’m excited to have her on stage, along with another friend of ours, Lizette, who’s doing some very important work with the UN in the same vein. So when Natasha is not just shaping the future of critical intelligence in tech or advocating for data driven DEI strategies, you’ll find her sharing her wisdom as a speaker and actively contributing to the business community throughout her many board memberships. So everyone, please welcome Natasha.
Amy Vaughn:
Thank you, Natasha, for being here to share your insights on mentorship and sponsorship and navigating the unique challenges that women that are capable and competent and amazing like you often face and feel like they maybe have to do alone.
Natasha Pongonis:
Thank you so much for having me. I’m so excited to have this conversation mostly because this is such an important topic. Mhmm. And, oftentime, we don’t really have the time to explore and really understand the impact. The sponsorship really means and how we can really help us. So, you know, mentorship, sponsorship has been incredible in my journey, and I can talk for hours about the importance of mentorship.
Amy Vaughn:
And Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
I think this platform is just perfect for that because you really have an audience. They have walked through a lot of the same challenges Mhmm. And they can share incredible stories. So I’m so excited about joining these ideas today and being part of the conference in 2 weeks. This conversation is gonna be incredible and so relevant in what we’re facing today and making sure that we are all sharing the experience and knowledge and empowering one another because we have a lot to get done. So the next generation of women’s leaders have a much easier path. With what we did. But still, I think part of the challenge is how do we enjoy a journey.
Natasha Pongonis:
So I love that. No bad experiences, only learning.
Amy Vaughn:
Right. Exactly. What did we learn from this? Because everyone goes through various ups and downs and struggles, and you’ve had a very impressive career. You’re a 3 time founder and now a CEO of Invisify Global Intelligence as I mentioned earlier. And as you said, you know, mentorship and sponsorship have played a critical role in your journey thus far, but I’d love for you to kind of walk our listeners through what that journey has looked like for you.
Natasha Pongonis:
Yeah. And I think, you know, looking back on my journey, especially in the United States, when I came to the US, I was an exchange student. I came for a program at The Ohio State University. And my professors, they were fluent in Spanish because they were teaching actually in my home country, which is Argentina. So when I came to OSU, I didn’t feel the need to learn the language. I was fluent in French, and I love the French language. So I had no interest in learning English at that time. Right.
Natasha Pongonis:
So when I met my husband and we got engaged, I was like, oh my god. This could be home. Mhmm. And I’m gonna have to learn the language. And I graduated. I graduated as an architect. And being an architect and working in a technical field, it really allowed me to get immersed in the workforce, get immersed in the culture of my community, and learn the language at the same time. But I’m so grateful and so thankful that, actually, companies decided to hire me even though I couldn’t really speak the language.
Natasha Pongonis:
But, clearly, my design and my ideas from an architecture standpoint was compelling enough to open that first door. And I think from there, 1, I think it was asking for help, who really helped me along the way. Just making sure that I was letting them know what I didn’t know and what were the areas I needed to support. Right. And making sure that I was aligning myself with those individuals. They wanted to be part of the journey, that they wanted to help me and be successful. And I think part of that, looking back, is 2 takeaways. I think one was identifying perhaps individuals that could relate to my experience either because they were, like, a first or second generation, perhaps immigrant to the United States, or they remember their moms or their grandparents, and they felt some empathy.
Natasha Pongonis:
Yeah. So that was 1. And number 2, again, I can say asking for help. I think we women often have time to be a little bit more shy Mhmm. About it. And when you are put in some extreme situations Mhmm. You realize that when you actually speak
Amy Vaughn:
out of the problem
Natasha Pongonis:
Right. Many solutions might be presented to you. If you didn’t ask, perhaps you have never seen some of those options in some of those solutions. But I think, you know, looking back and, you know, I’m very excited and very proud that I’m a 3 time founder, but I think that is kinda like that the drive of not seeing obstacles obstacles and challenges as she’s determined that I cannot pursue my dreams, but more so as a challenge and trying to figure out what is it that I need to do? What is the path that I can find? What are some of those allies that I can find in my community so I can really fulfill my dream? And I think one of my motto is, like, I wanna live with no regret. Right. And part of that is really focused on my professional journey. I don’t wanna leave with regret.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm. I love it. I agree wholeheartedly with you there. It’s like you got just one life. It’s like we gotta make it count. Right? And not taking that for granted and being intentional about where you’re going and how you’re getting there. And I love what you said about knowing what you don’t know. I think sometimes we don’t know where to start in asking for help because I think society from a societal standpoint, we’re also conditioned not to, you know, we have to be it all, we have to do it all, and we have to do it all alone as women often.
Amy Vaughn:
And that’s such a false narrative in my mind. There’s such strength and collective power. Like you said, it’s, like, it’s not one thing to just speak about the problem. It’s another thing to realize that, you know, you’re not the only one struggling with that problem, and that there’s so many people that have thoughts and ideas and potential solutions for you or that you have for them. And it’s, like, I think we discount the amount of experience and knowledge that we have to share between one another. And then I think it’s hard for us to be even though, you know, we tend to be vulnerable, we we it’s hard professionally, I think, sometimes, right, to get vulnerable. And then I also love what you said about goal setting and kind of having your ideal sort of career in the life in your mind and thinking about who do I need to help me get there.
Natasha Pongonis:
Yes.
Amy Vaughn:
You know, so often when we’re setting goals, we think it just solely depends on us. But, no, you need support from friends, or family. You need to speak those goals and not just into existence for the sake of manifestation. You need to let the world know so that they can show up and support you in the ways that you need support. Right?
Natasha Pongonis:
Absolutely. And I think, you know, talking about mentorship and sponsorship. Mhmm. I think the, you know, mentors oftentimes see in you quality or skills or strength and even weakness that you don’t see.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
And having a mentor who can be complete, transparent, and honest, because you a mentor is my friend. And sometimes we confuse our friends as our mentors. Right. Friends, they don’t wanna hurt your feelings. Men friends, they wanna make sure that you continue the friendship. A mentor is someone who’s gonna be completely honest. Mhmm. Because mentors, well, they want to make sure that you are successful in your journey.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
So we have to really make sure that we understand the distinctions.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah. Great.
Natasha Pongonis:
Can a mentor become a friend? Sure. It can. But I think as long as you make sure that the feedback that you’re getting is intended to help you grow.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
So I think, you know, part of the benefit to having that mentor is oftentimes, you might set your own goals. You might have your career path in your journey Mhmm. Based on your own self understanding of who you are and perhaps the capabilities until someone else sees you far beyond those capabilities. And now your goals in your journey can really grow exponentially. So that’s one of the really, I think, beauty that I didn’t understand at first Mhmm. Of the benefits of a mentor until I kinda I’m very visual. So I need to map out
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
My what I wanted to accomplish, what I wanted to do in that year, and having those conversations with a mentor when they start asking you questions. Right? Like, why that goal? What is that gonna take in the long way? What is your not your 12 months plan, but what is your 5 year, 10 years plan? Right? And when you start really seeing the long term journey, you can start very defining what are the guide rails that you need to have in place in order to accomplish those objectives. So I think mentors for me in that case have been incredible. And having not only a mentor that you can check once in a while, but also having someone who’s gonna keep you accountable.
Amy Vaughn:
Yes.
Natasha Pongonis:
And the person who’s gonna keep you accountable might not necessarily be your mentor. There might be someone who’s actually also going through the same journey that you are where you can keep each other accountable and making sure that you actually those are the goals that you have set, and the guide rails have already been in place, making sure that you are actually very intentional in the process. So when I have my meetings with my accountable body, we meet on a quarterly basis.
Amy Vaughn:
Love it.
Natasha Pongonis:
It’s really you know, it really helped me to choose to have a reset and evaluate time allocation, which is a critical priority. And I think often that what we don’t do as women is putting us first. Yep. We oftentimes put everyone else
Amy Vaughn:
Oh, yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
First, So when we have something, in my case, it’s visual, when I sit down and I’m like, okay. I’m I’m it’s time to check out with my, with my friend and how much I have accomplished in this past quarter. Did I actually do what I meant to do? And if not, it’s a good reminder to, again, have that reset and really redefine time allocation.
Amy Vaughn:
Right. Yeah. Yeah. I think having a plan and sticking to it, something that’s recurring, is really, really smart. I think for me, I like to look for mentors that are my disagreeable givers. I’ve talked about this book so many times now. I won’t go into depth about all of it. You guys can just look into it.
Amy Vaughn:
It’s Adam Grant’s give and take, and it’s really those folks who, you know, also speak with radical candor, another great book, Kim Scott. We’ve had her on the podcast in the past as well. People who will tell you the things that you don’t always want to hear, but you need to hear. Like, you were saying, they’re not. They are your friends in the sense that they’re giving you their time and they’re generous with it and they’re paying attention, but it also they will see something that maybe you’re not seeing, and they’re not going to be afraid to tell you straight up what it is that you need to hear because that’s what you need for growth. You need somebody that’s going to push you. So that’s something I look for when it comes to a mentor. Natasha, what do you look for when you look for a mentor?
Natasha Pongonis:
You know, and I think there are different mentors based on the journey that you’re going through. Right? So, I remember I had a great mentor when I launched my second company.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
And I started on the fundraising route. And fundraising, especially for women, is extremely hard.
Amy Vaughn:
Very difficult.
Natasha Pongonis:
Because when you look at the representation from a VC to angel investor, the majorities are male
Amy Vaughn:
Yep.
Natasha Pongonis:
And white males. Mhmm. So I realized I needed to have a mentor that really already walked through the same journey that I had. So I reached out to this, what, incredible lady who has worked in the hardest and highly male dominated industry, which is in the oil industry. And she did it, and she was extremely successful. And she was great for that phase during that time because I was going through the fundraising phase. And then when I launched my 3rd company
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
It was a very different approach, a different, very technology focused one. So I knew they needed to find somebody. They can be a little bit more understanding from a technology standpoint. Right. More so. So I think I have a collection of mentors.
Amy Vaughn:
But it’s definitely more aligned with, like, your goals. Right? Based on your objectives and your goals, you want somebody with that specific, you know, industry expertise, insight, insider knowledge to help you kind of crack that instead of trying to figure it out for yourself. You know? Like, why? Trade. Why?
Natasha Pongonis:
And I think it was. So it’s very interesting. I think one of the mentors that I first reached out to when I launched my company about 15 years ago, 13 years ago, there is a comp that has an online score. I don’t know if you know the score.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm. I
Natasha Pongonis:
got it. Right? So it’s an organization. I didn’t know. It was my first time launching a company. I didn’t know who I could ask for help. And someone mentioned about Score. Going to Score, you can find a mentor that way. So I was like, I’m gonna check it out.
Natasha Pongonis:
So I did. And just happened to be the lady you cannot fill out, you know, where your requirements are. I didn’t really understand much about finance. I didn’t understand p and l’s. I didn’t understand the projections. Yeah.
Amy Vaughn:
So
Natasha Pongonis:
I need someone who can help me. I understood I had the vision for my company. I knew what I wanted to do. I was very clear on the services. What I wasn’t very clear about was how I could create a financial plan for my company that was beyond the 6 months and the 12 months, but I cannot have in the 5 years plan? So that’s how I reached out to SCORE. I found this incredible woman, who happened to be an investor, very well known in the community. I was even shocked that she was actually donating her time
Amy Vaughn:
Uh-huh.
Natasha Pongonis:
At SCORE. So I reached out. We connected, and we clicked right away. So she accepted to be my mentor. But then as we started to have our relationship and our meetings, she realized that, actually, her mentee at the time would be a better mentor to me than she would. So she put the connection
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
With Hermenty at the time, who became my mentor, you know, a long time ago, and, and he still is. Yeah. And we developed a friendship.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
But a friendship that’s very clearly defined on how we can support one another Mhmm. In the journey that we have. He’s also a serial entrepreneur. Yeah. And now he’s asked me many times to actually mentor some of his female employees. Right. But now I’m sitting on the board of one of his companies. That’s great.
Natasha Pongonis:
So it’s interesting how, right, that relationship with him was my mentor. Mhmm. But now I’m a mentor to his employees, but not only that. I now have a seat at the table in one of his companies. That’s fantastic. And I think part of that is making sure that when you have those relationships with a mentor, it is being able that you actually are allocating the time, and you are very intentional in building those relationships. Yeah. Because even with mentors that I had in the past that were very specific in an in one time
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
Of my company, I still reach out. We still have good relationships. Right? Christmas time comes and you send a card or you send a text or a phone call. You wanna check-in because you never know
Amy Vaughn:
Exactly.
Natasha Pongonis:
When you might actually need that advice again.
Amy Vaughn:
And it’s such a good point. That’s such a fantastic point. Anybody that is looking for a mentor or is currently a mentee, I think that’s a big mistake some of us make as mentees is that we forget that it’s a two way street. So even when I’m at the table with my mentors, I’m always asking them. I always make sure that there’s time before we walk away from the table to say, how can I help you? What is it that you’re working on that, you know, you need help with? And, I mean, it can be something as simple as spreading the word about an event they’re working on, another big project that they’re doing. Maybe they need help and resources. You know, you have something to offer as well, and that helps build that trust and relationship to show that it’s a mutual two way street. Right? And then like you said, following up, showing gratitude.
Amy Vaughn:
I always try to send something in the way of a thank you to those who are kind of my consistent mentors throughout the year, just to let them know, like, how much their time means to me. And it’s such a small act, but it really just helps, like you said, solidify that relationship. And the last thing you want is to be in a crisis situation and then have to be, like, knocking on people’s doors, like, begging for somebody’s ear. And I say this for women in general too about networking. We tend to wait and hold off until we have a major life event, a career pivot that needs to happen or we get laid off or fired. And then we’re like, oh, now I need a network. And then all of a sudden you’re banging on people’s doors or calling people up for coffee that you haven’t talked to in 5 years. And it’s kinda hard, and it feels icky because you’re like, I need something, and that’s why I’m showing up.
Amy Vaughn:
But if you work on finding ways to just make a regular habit or cadence of building those relationships and the connections, One, the rewarding, because we need connection as human beings. 2, you’ve got things to offer to people, you know, when you’re showing up to these opportunities, whether it’s a mentor or a networking situation. And 3, it just makes it feel a lot less daunting when you are in basically a big old pile of poop, and things are going to hell, and you can be calling on your people saying, hey. I need your help. And they’re, like, right there for you because you’ve always shown up and been right there for them. It makes it all so much easier. One thing I would like to do for those who are listening and live listeners, please don’t forget you can, jump into the chat and ask any questions that you have for Natasha while we’re having this conversation. But I would love for you to help people who are maybe earlier on in their career understand what’s the difference between a mentor and a sponsor? Because I don’t know that everybody knows that there’s a difference and why it’s important to have both.
Natasha Pongonis:
Yeah. That’s a great question. I think so. So I understand, right, that you have that mentor and we just talked about how important it is to nurture those relationships because it’s the mentor who eventually will become your sponsor.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah. Right?
Natasha Pongonis:
So I think we should talk about setting goals. You have a mentor who can help you figure out what are the objectives that you wanna do, but it’s actually the mentor or the sponsor who’s gonna help you to make sure that those goals and the objective actually become reality.
Amy Vaughn:
Yep.
Natasha Pongonis:
So we’re talking about a career path. Right? You can, you are just entering the career. You just got your first job with corporate America, and then you have your mentor who’s someone who perhaps has been in the field or in the company 5, 10 plus years, and is someone who can help you figure out what that map looks like? What is the career path that you wanna pursue? What are some of the, perhaps, you know, recommendations that you wanna do? Or what is the next job that you wanna apply for? But it’s actually that mentor who could potentially be and most likely will be when those decisions are taking place.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
And the decision makers are at the table, and you wanna make sure that those are your mentors or your sponsors, because those are the ones that are gonna be the first one bringing your name up and and highlighting the accomplishment that you have done, the the goals that you have been able to accomplish. Yeah. So you wanted to make sure that, again, how important it is to build those relationships because your mentor will become your sponsor. It’s that person who is at the table when the conversations where you are not there Yeah. And is there to highlight and really bring your name up so you can have all those opportunities.
Amy Vaughn:
Absolutely. You are 100% right. I need to send you this article. I just read an article from the Harvard Business Review. After having read another one that just made my, like, stomach turn, I was like, god. I was telling women to show up in order to just in general to show up as leaders that we had to, like this is what attractive leadership looks like. This is what unattractive I’m like, okay. So that language already
Natasha Pongonis:
Yeah. Let’s put that at the door. Yeah.
Amy Vaughn:
It was, like, not neurodivergent friendly. It was not introverted. It was not gender friendly. It was just, like, all these things. Well, then they have this other article that they published recently that talks about how women actually move up in the world. And this is to me why it’s such an important topic, mentorship and sponsorship. Sponsorship. Like you said, sponsors are the people who will speak your name in the rooms that you are not in.
Amy Vaughn:
They have a seat at the table. They are of influence within a certain space or industry company that you are interested in, and they are either backing you by, you know, again, validating your experience, your knowledge, who you are, or they’re putting money on the table for you. Like, literally sponsoring with money at that time saying, I’ll pay for you to attend this thing because I think you need to be in this room. Those are sponsors. You know? So they are taking a different kind of action maybe than a mentor that’s, like, more of a coaching space. And this article was saying, basically, women, when the studies were showing, like, I gotta I said, I’ll send this to you because I know you’ll love it.
Natasha Pongonis:
Oh, please. Yes.
Amy Vaughn:
You know, they had, like, a man and a woman, talking at a presentation, and they flipped it to where the man was leading the presentation, and then the woman led the presentation. And the woman was actually knocked more for being overly aggressive and dominating when she was leading versus the man who was assertive and a leader, blah blah blah. We know this. We hear this all the time. Right? That stupid double standard. But they also found that, you know, FaceTime with leaders was also not serving women well. And they said, like, some 40% of women actually did not form strong bonds with leadership when they had more time with them. What they found is that how we move ahead is through what they called third party validation.
Amy Vaughn:
It’s when other people refer to us. Mhmm. It is when a friend of mine, a mutual connection of ours says, hey, Amy. You need to talk to Natasha because she’s amazing. She runs this company and does blah blah blah blah. It gives me all your background, tells me how awesome you are. And as soon as we get on the call, it’s like, I already have it in my mind that you were validated in all these things. And so boom, you’re in.
Amy Vaughn:
You know? And this for women is, like, that’s that’s really the way that they’re finding that we have to do this. This sponsorship is huge.
Natasha Pongonis:
It is huge. And yeah. And I think that that also brings another point. Mhmm. Very important. I think we women have to be ready for those moments.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
Because you never know when that sponsor is gonna be speaking on your behalf. And it might happen that you get a text on a Friday at 5 PM or Thursday at 9 PM saying, hey. I have a meeting tomorrow morning. I’m having coffee with the CEO of company x y z. Send me your bio. Send me your resume. I love it.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
And then 2, 3 days later, when you send that information, it’s too late. You missed that opportunity. So I think it’s very important that, you know, we and these are, like, global steps. Right? It doesn’t require much time, but then your LinkedIn profile is up to date.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
That your picture is up to date, that you have a professional picture up to date, but also that you have a bio that’s really ready to be sent out. And that goes online to what are some of your goals and your objectives. Right? What is it that you wanna accomplish? What is a career path? And making sure that you are actually highlighting the strength that you have aligned with those objectives. Yes. But I cannot tell you the number of times that I have sent an email or text, saying, send me your resume right now. I have this opportunity. It’s perfect for you. Mhmm.
Amy Vaughn:
And
Natasha Pongonis:
then I don’t hear back until days later. Yeah. And so we need to also make sure that, you know, how we set ourselves as a priority and what it is that we need to do to make sure that we are ready because time is critical. Yeah. And I learned the hard way the hard way. So I’m not saying this because I read it somewhere. I’m sharing the story because it happens to me not once, but twice. And at that point, I was like, okay.
Natasha Pongonis:
Clearly, it’s my problem. Yeah. No one else’s problem is me. I need to fix this. So doesn’t mean that you might have many bios. I have so many bios depending on, am I looking for a consulting job? Is it a board job? Is it a potential client? Is it a mentorship? And I have all my buyers ready. I have different resumes ready. And I think also, I talked to so many great amazing women.
Natasha Pongonis:
They have been working in corporate for their whole life, and now they’ve realized that they’re ready to take the next step. Yeah. They wanna start their own journey. They wanna start their own company. Yeah. Maybe they wanna be a consultant. And I love just reviewing resumes or bios. So oftentimes, we are, like, really settling ourselves so short.
Amy Vaughn:
Oh, absolutely. Do
Natasha Pongonis:
that. No. Because you wanted no one’s gonna help you if you’re not speaking on your behalf. It starts with you. Exactly. But, also, resumes are great if you’re looking for a job. But if you are looking for a speaking engagement, if you’re looking for a board seat, nonprofit, or for profit, or consultancy, or being a, you know, fractional CMO or CEO, do a bio. Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
Bio works much better than a 2 pages resume.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
Because people really wanted to understand who you are to the core. What are your passions? What are your strengths? What have you done? And you can really highlight that in a 1 pager that’s concise.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
So if there is any takeaway from this podcast today, just make sure that you have a bio ready to go.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah. Make it easy for people to champion you. Don’t make it more work. Like, they’re doing you a tremendous favor by basically putting you in front of some other really important people. So it’s, like, don’t don’t hesitate. Don’t second guess. Just be, like, yep. Got it.
Amy Vaughn:
If you need to, here’s a fun trick, ladies. Go into chat gpt or whatever your favorite generative AI is. Put your existing bio in there, and then prompt it to write it like a confident white dude. Say, like, give me, like, the most hyped, you know, bio and put it in the tone of this, and it’ll give you something and you’ll be like, oh, I would never think to say these things about myself, but it does sound pretty stellar. And, of course, you’re gonna go and edit it and refine it, but don’t delete the badassness of it. Like, keep all that in there. But yeah. And then, again, you’ve got more people to look around and ask to say, hey.
Amy Vaughn:
Can you remove my bio and help me, or how do I add this up? You know? But still, like, don’t don’t sit on it. I think sometimes we get so on our heads, about the opportunity that you’re right, that we miss an important piece of timing. And you do talk about that a lot, that timing is an important part of mentorship and sponsorship. Is there any other examples that, like, you would wanna share or that or, like, maybe how women can identify the right moment to maybe seek or leverage any of these relationships, mentorship, sponsorship?
Natasha Pongonis:
Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, I think, one of the feedback they got, I can’t remember, it was, like, maybe 8 years ago or something. I was in a really great situation. I got in. I was invited to be part of a roundtable conversation at the White House and talk about women’s honor, small business owner, Latinas honor.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
And it was great. And, actually, that opportunity again came through a sponsor who was at the right time, at the right conversation. And when the White House asked for, do we know do you know somebody that will recommend you to have this conversation? My name came out. Uh-huh. So it was great. Then after we had the meeting, it was, you know, obviously all over the news and the media, and I was getting phone calls from CNN and NBC, from all these different outlets, to have this conversation. And part of one of the feedback that I got from my sponsor is don’t be reactive. Be proactive.
Natasha Pongonis:
Yeah.
Amy Vaughn:
And
Natasha Pongonis:
I was and it took me a little bit to process that information. And by her saying be proactive, not reactive, what she was trying to say is, you know that you were doing this wire round table at the White House.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
Instead of having, right, CNN or all these different news outlet reaching out to you, you should have already have a press release out
Amy Vaughn:
Oh, yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
With your name in advance. Make sure that you’re promoting this with all your network Yeah. And being reactive after the fact. So I think sometimes, you know, it’s hard to perhaps have the full understanding and the impact of some situations.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
But maybe taking the 5 minutes where you can really ask yourself, do an assessment, evaluate the opportunity that you are being given and how you can truly maximize Right. Those opportunities. So that feedback from my mentor was so important because she was right. I was being reactive, and I wasn’t being proactive. Mhmm. And I will take that forever. So every time there is an event Mhmm. Or any type of opportunity, I’m always asking myself.
Natasha Pongonis:
Am I being reactive? Am I being proactive?
Amy Vaughn:
Active. I love that so much. Well and I would say too, I think that just sets you up to be the kind of person people want to keep recommending. Right? When you show up and you make the most of an opportunity and they get to see the impact of that, anybody that’s sitting on this call or listening to the podcast right now that is a mentor, there is nothing better than watching a mentee take an opportunity that you have put in their lap and just knock it out of the park. Like, that is why you mentor. You know? And then all that does is make you think, okay. Yeah. The next time I see something like this come up, this is the person I’m recommending.
Amy Vaughn:
You know? So it’s not just a service to yourself and the opportunity, but it’s really doing a service to the person that puts you up in that position to begin with.
Natasha Pongonis:
Absolutely. And I think, you know, leverage this platform. I think that Together Digital and the amount of women that we have in the group, sometimes, you know, reach out if you don’t know where to start or you don’t have a mentor. You don’t know how because it’s your first time. It’s really hard to navigate things for the first time. So I think that’s very important, again, to reach out to somebody Mhmm. You know, on the website, LinkedIn. They’re always featuring women there in the interview.
Natasha Pongonis:
You know, they have already done it.
Amy Vaughn:
What tips do you have? What tips do you have for folks who don’t maybe have a mentor yet that are looking for 1? Like, where do they start?
Natasha Pongonis:
Yeah. So I think reaching out, number 1. Right? So I have attended so many conferences, and then I’m walking away. I’m like, oh my god. This woman really Uh-huh. Spoke to my soul, and I wanna connect. Uh-huh. And, you know, and it can be intimidating because you might be, you know, senior vice president of the largest company in the United States.
Natasha Pongonis:
Yep. But I will send out a message on LinkedIn and say, hey. I was in the audience. If you really spoke to the core of what I’m trying to go through. You have 5 minutes. And doesn’t have to be in person. It can be virtual. And I will say that I had more yeses than noes by doing that And the amount of choice generosity from women who have achieved that level, and they wanted to give back.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
So even if it’s 5 minutes, 10 minutes, don’t abuse it. So don’t ask for an hour-long call. But Yes. Even with a 10 minute meeting that you come prepared with the questions that you wanna ask, what is it that you wanna get taken away from that conversation Yep. It’s gonna be so important. And sometimes, that first introduction call, if maybe it’s 10 minutes, can really lead to a friendship or could lead to a mentorship and eventually a sponsorship. Yeah. So I think it’s just, you know, we have so many tools in our hands that we can use.
Natasha Pongonis:
LinkedIn is one of those. TikTok, there are so many thought leaders in TikTok sharing their own experiences. Oh, yeah. You can reach out as well. And so I think it’s just making sure, again, that you understand what it is that you wanted to accomplish, what you wanted to get out of the relationship. Yep. And just put yourself out there.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm. Yeah. I love that. And I I often say follow your envy. It shows you what you really truly desire and what you want. And so sometimes I’ll be, you’re right. I know I’ll go to an event or a conference or I’ll be following somebody on a specific platform, and I get a little bit of a girl crush, and I’m thinking, my gosh. She’s just doing amazing things, and I don’t know how she’s doing it.
Amy Vaughn:
And rather than throw shade or shame myself and think I could never be that, like, why not just, like you said, just reach out, give her that credit and say, I think you’re amazing. I love what you’re doing, and I love what you said there. If you spoke to the core of something that I am also trying to do. So show alignment and then be specific and say, I think that you could be a potential fantastic mentor for me if that’s something that you’re open to. Like, be direct in what you’re asking for each and every time you meet. I think that’s also really important because like you said, you can’t use a mentor session like a therapy session because mentorship is not therapy. Right? You need to have some clear objectives and you need to come a little bit prepared with something, you know, specific to sort of tackle. So this is something I just wanna share, if you don’t mind, a framework that a boss and a sponsor mentor taught me once that I have literally used ever since, and then I’ve kind of put it out there loosely.
Amy Vaughn:
Because I feel like everybody has, like, their own way of sort of coming at all of this. And I don’t think mentorship is meant to be, like, structured specifically a certain way. But I often encourage people to at least just show up with what he called the 3 c’s, which is a comment, which is your general status. This is so easy to remember. Comment on your general status. How are things since the last time we met? A celebration, it’s a second c. Great way to slow down and be like, I did something really awesome since we last met. And then the third one is a concern, like a genuine, honest, straightforward concern, problem that you were facing.
Amy Vaughn:
And that’s usually where you spend most of the time. Usually, my, like, comments, like, maybe the most 5 minutes, if more like 2, my celebration, because, again, we don’t really often know how to brag on ourselves and celebrate. Maybe a minute. Right? And then the concern, and that’s really where you spend the bulk of your time. But those 3 c’s, even if I am, like, so bogged down and then I kinda miss on the calendar, I’m like, oh my gosh. I have a standing meeting with a mentor. I can get on a call in 5 minutes. I can at least come up with my 3 c’s in that framework and, like, go into that, and that really helps us guide the conversation and sort of keep me on the rails.
Amy Vaughn:
You know?
Natasha Pongonis:
I love it. It’s so easy to remember. I’m gonna definitely keep that in mind. Yeah. That’s great. Because
Amy Vaughn:
I’m a verbal processor as well. So it’s like, I have to be careful. And I did do that often with my mentors in my early days where god loved them. They would just sit and listen and listen. Yes.
Natasha Pongonis:
No. That’s such great advice. Yeah. I think being, you know, preparing is so important, that you should show up. But Yeah. And that goes for everything in life, not just with the relationship with mentors. So, yeah, being prepared is
Amy Vaughn:
key. And one of the things I wanted to ask you about is this balance of being a mentor and a mentee. Because I’ll tell you, I am surprised not only by how many women don’t currently have a mentor, and then, so they’re not, like, in that mentee space. But how many women don’t even seek to be mentors? I’m like, wait. This should kinda just be like you should. In my opinion, I don’t even care how many years of experience you have or how old you are. You are, I don’t know if you agree with me or not. I I don’t think I’m ever gonna not need a mentor. Yeah.
Amy Vaughn:
What do you think?
Natasha Pongonis:
Oh, absolutely. 100%. I mean, we always need a mentor. Yeah. Always. And I think it could be intimidating. Right? So I think the first time that someone asked me if I can be a mentor, I was like, oh my god. No.
Natasha Pongonis:
I’m not prepared. Like, how can I be a mentor? Like, no. But it’s really not a requirement. There is no description of what the mentor should look like. It’s making sure that that you are thoughtful, that you care, that you’re generous, that you can actually have empathy
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
For the person that you are in front of and making sure that you actually really care about making an impact. Yeah. So it doesn’t have to be that you have reached and you’re now as in the C suite executive. Because, again, you’re gonna need mentors.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
All different knowledge and experience and background, and every single one brings something very unique to the table. So I think, you know, it’s just putting yourself out there. Yeah. Learning to say more yes than no. And and just I think the beauty of the mentorship, also often time, when I have the title of being a mentor, I’m learning so much as
Amy Vaughn:
well. 100%.
Natasha Pongonis:
So it’s a two way learning. It’s not just that you are in the mentor role and you telling
Amy Vaughn:
and dictating.
Natasha Pongonis:
No. It’s two dictating. No. It’s two ways of learning, and it’s a beautiful experience, a beautiful relationship.
Amy Vaughn:
Agreed. I definitely look up to the women that I mentor because they have, like, you know, I have, like, a 20 years on them, but then I look at them and I’m thinking where I was when I was their age. And I’m just like, you are so much more put together, and you’re already leaning into mentorship, and you’re following up on things. And I’m just like, yeah, you’re just getting light years ahead. And, you know, and being pro like you said, proactive and not reactive. And that’s not to shame anybody, but I think it is just one of those things where it’s like, you know, sitting back and watching them and seeing the ways that they approach and also see the world and the workforce, I think, is also important to have that perspective. Because now that I’m on, like, the weird other side of, you know, the workforce and the generational divides. Yes.
Amy Vaughn:
You know? It’s weird. It’s weird. You know? I’m I’m not it’s as much as my brain doesn’t wanna believe it. I’m not a recent graduate. I didn’t start working 5 years ago. And so it’s like I’m on the other end of the spectrum. So the workforce and the next generation of folks coming in, I really do wanna hear and see how they see the world and how they see work and how they see themselves in it. And I think, you know, I agree.
Amy Vaughn:
There’s always so much to learn from them, almost as much as the other way around.
Natasha Pongonis:
And I think you bring, like, a really good point on that. Maybe not necessarily in the mentorship or sponsorship conversation, but I think definitely on having a seat at the table conversation. Yeah. Because oftentimes and I see that in in some of the board, there’s in a nonprofit or for profit where
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
Right, we’re looking for years of experience, which is great because you wanna have those conversations on the table. But you also wanna have those conversations and have people on the table who are your customers that you’re trying to reach, the demographic that you’re trying to reach, and making sure that you also have those voices on the table. So I sat on the board of a nonprofit, and we had our annual meeting and the retreat, and we were talking and planning about the next year. And I was very new, and I was like, okay. I’m looking around, and I’m like, this is great. Some of the board members have been here for 20 years, 18 years. Some have less than that. But it was very striking that there was no one in the room that is a community we’re trying to serve.
Natasha Pongonis:
So how can
Amy Vaughn:
We create the voice of a customer.
Natasha Pongonis:
A plan. How can we create what are the goals? If we don’t have that voice on the table, the individuals who are really being impacted by Yep. Or the individuals who are going through that program. So I think sometimes we need to really take a step back, take a look, understand what is the impact that we wanted to make, and who are the voices that need to have. We need to have it at that table.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
So the goals that we create in the products, the solutions that we’re creating are relevant and not a true representation of those needs, or problems that we’re trying to solve. And it makes sense when you talk about it, but sometime when you look again on the framework and the rules and systems, it doesn’t always is there
Amy Vaughn:
as complete. Don’t align. That’s such a great point. I mean, sort of on that note, obviously, with your business and what you do, you talk a lot about cultural intelligence, and it’s a big part of the work that you do. How do you think that intersects with mentorship, especially for women with diverse backgrounds? Like, how would you speak to that?
Natasha Pongonis:
Yeah. I mean, culture is just such a great topic of conversation. Mhmm. It’s been around for so many forever, right, since humans were alive. I think now that we’re starting to take a little bit more serious conversation and understanding the impact of culture, especially in the workforce. Yeah. So I think, you know, we’re and you mentioned the age gap. Right? We’re seeing this generation, especially in the workforce.
Natasha Pongonis:
Right? The gen c entering the workforce. Yeah. And we still have the boomer generation in the workforce. So we’re really having, like, 4 or 5 generations Yeah. Right now in one space. Mhmm. And each brings in a very different experience. So we’re starting to see such a diverse population in the workforce.
Natasha Pongonis:
And it’s not only sometimes when we’re talking about culture, people think, oh, it’s ethnicity. It’s not. It’s a lifestyle. It’s education. It’s age. It’s gender. So it’s so, so rich and diverse. So we really have to learn how we go deeper in those cultural nuances.
Natasha Pongonis:
So I’m sure you have seen the iceberg of culture. Right?
Amy Vaughn:
Where we
Natasha Pongonis:
we only see and we focus on what we see above the water. But it’s really everything that goes below the water that is very critical. So from a cultural standpoint, you know, one of the interesting, I think, perhaps experiences that I had right after the pandemic. Right? We’re starting to go back into the workforce, perhaps, you know, 5 days a week, might be 2, might be 3. Yeah. And companies trying to be more intentional about what is a pipeline of talent. What does it look like? And, really, from a cultural standpoint, right, starting to see there is the gap in communication and gap in needs. Perhaps the needs were relevant when you’re applying for a job 20 years ago, 30 years ago.
Natasha Pongonis:
It’s not the same as today. So they need to adapt. But I think what I have seen that works, from a cultural standpoint, but also from my age and ethnicity, is really creating a system from an onboarding process from an entry level all the way to making sure that you’re creating a healthy and sustainable pipeline for the c suite role. And oftentimes, that comes with something as simple as creating and having a strategic mentorship program within the company.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
Could be a body system, where you have somebody who actually will be from the day that you walk in and help you to navigate what is the first date of work. And what I heard sometimes is that in culture training is very critical. And that in culture training means somebody who can relate to the challenges that you’re going through. And that could come from gender, could be from ethnicity, could be from life experience, education. Right? Yes. Maybe
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
She went to the same sorority that you did. Mhmm. So that in culture peace is so important to making sure the companies not only are focusing on the attraction of candidates, but the retention of the candidate. The retention is great. Right. Sadly, what I often hear in in some of my work is women’s and people of color, the candle feel stuck, right, in that entry level
Amy Vaughn:
Oh, yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
Mid management level. And and part of that is, you know, when I have the my my interview is they don’t see someone like them
Amy Vaughn:
Exactly.
Natasha Pongonis:
In the c suite. They don’t see someone like them. So we need to make sure that we break that status quo. That we don’t feel like, okay. There is no one like me. I guess this is as far as I can go. Yep. No.
Natasha Pongonis:
You definitely can go farther. Yeah. And part of that is having those honest conversations.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
Right? So find that mentor, find that sponsor in your company, find someone who you can have an honest conversation with. But, also, don’t bring problems. Bring solutions Yep. To those conversations. So if you see an opportunity, if you see a problem within the company and your own company Right. Making sure that you also come prepared with solutions. And how can you create any strategic program perhaps that can not only help you, but help the company as a large. So I think, you know, having some of those monies through ERG programs are great, but sometimes a bit limited in funding.
Natasha Pongonis:
So they can only do so much. Yeah. But that is when it counts, perhaps, when you might know some organizations Mhmm. They are supporting additional levels, like Together Digital, where they can actually be an arm of those ERG groups. Yes. And how you can be more strategic and how you can provide additional support to what the company already has so that the impact is greater.
Amy Vaughn:
That’s so much good information in there, Natasha, just to talk about and highlight. So much good stuff. Yeah. I mean, not not feeling seen is such an issue for so many people, and I don’t know why it’s so hard for folks at the top to not see and understand, but, of course, like, it’s hard to see the waters that you swim in. It’s hard to understand the problems of the world that you don’t have to walk in and experience day in and day out. And so that is why I think it is really, really important to find mentors, you know, even if it means going outside the walls of your company to find people that, you know, maybe do sort of align or, you know, experience similar problems that you might have experienced, but have managed to kind of break through on the glass ceiling or whatever that is, whatever barriers they have faced. Mhmm. Because at the end of the day, while it’s important to have, you know, mentors and allies that don’t look like you, it’s going to be hard for them to sometimes understand the deeper, more subversive things that you might be facing.
Amy Vaughn:
Right? As you’re kind of moving through your career. And it’s just so hard for us to be and see the things that we can’t see. You know, it’s hard to model that because we’re not gonna get there in the same way we aren’t afforded the same privileges. And so it’s one of those things that it’s like, once you once you see this, it’s really hard to unsee it. But for some people, I think there’s just a lot of guilt behind that. Because, I mean, I don’t care who you are. We all walk around with a certain amount of privilege. But I think as soon as you can see it and acknowledge it and start to work to actually leverage it for the right reasons, that’s what’s empowering.
Amy Vaughn:
Like, don’t sit in shame. Take it and, like, do something with it. And mentorship is a really great way, but also sponsorship. I think when you’re in that position of privilege, I think that’s where sponsorship versus mentorship makes a lot of sense. That’s where it’s like me having a lot of great male allies and champions in my past. I had a ton of great guys who were like, oh, oh, yeah. That Amy Vaughn, you need to talk to her. I know a joke.
Amy Vaughn:
Got a job that doubled my salary once because I talked to, like, the guy that wanted to hire me spoke to one of my college teachers who was also a mentor of mine. They worked together at Leo Burnett years before that. Another guy in strategy who wanted to hire me spoke highly of me, and then another associate creative director who had interviewed me, like, 3 years prior. All 3 knew me. All 3 spoke highly of me, and this guy had no doubt. He’s like, you’re the person I want. I just need you to go through the formalities, but here’s the role. Here’s the client, and here’s the salary.
Amy Vaughn:
And it was no joke double my salary. That’s what I mean by this whole third party validation. Didn’t have to go through all the hoops. And this guy just found me on LinkedIn one day, and I’m like opening up. I mean, is this a joke? Is this spam? Like, trying to look him up to see if he’s real. And, you know, it’s one of those things where, you know, you mentioned ERGs. I love the intent of ERGs. I think where they rob me the wrong way is that we often ask people who are in those marginalized groups to create the safe spaces and to do the work of bringing content with limited funding and resources.
Amy Vaughn:
And they’re asking people who are already being, like, overutilized and underpaid typically for their roles to now do more free work to make everybody else that looks like them feel comfortable. And that’s what drives me nuts. And that’s why we have groups like Together Digital, because I think we can be that safe space and extension of your company and culture. We are partners. We’re the kind of organization that is going to help your women feel more seen, heard, valued, and assured that there is a path forward. And that even though there might not be people at the top that look like them, there are women that are moving through the industry that look like them, and that there is a way forward. And, you know, I was a member first as many of our listeners already know. And I would just walk in after one of our events, and I just always seem so lit up.
Amy Vaughn:
People were like, were you on it together at a digital event today? I was like, yes. Because I felt like as a working mom balancing my ambition and motherhood and a lack of sleep and everything else that goes into the messiness of motherhood, especially when they’re very little and you’re an agency creative, it was so good to at least start my day with a group of women, that I could talk about some things that I would not dare speak about in, you know, the rooms at my office or my agency. And so it helped me show up better and more whole at work. You know? And I just think sometimes people don’t realize what a gift that can be to give to their team and their employees. So I do think about looking for external support for your teams, and I’m not just saying it has to be Together Digital, but there’s other organizations, amazing organizations out there. Give them those opportunities to be in the spaces where they’re not the minority in the room for a minute and let them feel that sense of belonging, and let those tables be turned for a minute.
Natasha Pongonis:
Absolutely. And that’s actually a great way also to find a mentor. Yes. Right? Volunteer in some of those organizations.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
And if there is some scene that you wanted to explore and perhaps you don’t know how, join a committee.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
And in the committee, you’re gonna really learn so much about it by individuals that have, you know, the subject matter expert
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah.
Natasha Pongonis:
In that industry. But also that’s how you start building your own community Absolutely. And funding those mentors and sponsors. I think, you know, allocate that time, join organizations, show up to those meetings, go to those events. It’s gonna be so important in your journey.
Amy Vaughn:
It is. It is. And you bring up a good point there too as well. Like, even your peers can serve as mentors because even though somebody is just, like, a half step ahead of you, you know, they’re, like, living it or they just lived it. So, like, how fantastic is it to be, like, right there with somebody that truly remembers what it was like to be in your shoes? Alright. This question, I’m not sure if you don’t have, like, an exact exact example. I know that, like, data. We’re both data nerds, and a lot of what you do is centered around data.
Amy Vaughn:
But I was just wondering if there was ever any instance where a data driven insight helped, either you or your mentee make a critical career decision. Because sometimes when you’re kind of looking at things, it’s like, it’s hard to know what to pinpoint and what to move on, where and when.
Natasha Pongonis:
Yeah. No. I mean, I think, you know, just perhaps something that we can all relate. And, you know, part of the data that we do is really understanding consumer behavior, is understanding emotions, understanding pain points, and it could be either in the workforce or can be from products that we use and consume every day.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
And it was very interesting in one of the jobs a few years ago that we started in the CPG industry, in the beauty industry in particular. And we were working with a hair care brand.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
And they were really trying to figure out, you know, how much Can we find influencers? We’re coming out with this product. We love it. It’s great. And oftentimes, brands, you know, they’re like, we know it at all. We know our audience. We know who our customer is. And we’re like, okay. Great.
Natasha Pongonis:
But let’s just tell the data. Tell us the story. Let’s just see and
Amy Vaughn:
I love that.
Natasha Pongonis:
And really being able to understand from the consumer perspective, perhaps not from the brand perspective. But it was really interesting just to see the evolution of some of the data points that we’re collecting with this brand that was creating this haircut product
Amy Vaughn:
Uh-huh.
Natasha Pongonis:
Where their demographics were females, Latinas, black women, and they wanted to bring some color and more vibrant styles. And it was a great product, a great brand. Love the campaign. But then we realized when we were doing the analysis because it’s like the analysis you do pre campaign, during, and post. And so you can really have a holistic understanding. As we discover that the products that they were creating weren’t really meant for the hairstyle and the hair type Okay. Of the target audience. And the results were really unexpected.
Natasha Pongonis:
And part of that, again, it becomes because, we’re tar they were targeting, right, a different demographic where this child perhaps was curly and not straight. It wasn’t thin. It was a little bit thicker. And so but that is how some of the data point. But not only that, we actually discovered that the actual men were loving the product, and they were loving to have fun with the product. Uh-huh. So that was a demographic that wasn’t even part of the strategy.
Amy Vaughn:
Right.
Natasha Pongonis:
And so I think that was interesting. 1, to bring awareness about if you’re trying to reach a particular demographic Mhmm. You need to make sure that you also do your research ahead of time and understand what are some of the needs, what are some of the challenges, and what are the products or services or solutions that you’re trying to bring. Yeah. Is that really gonna make the impact that you expect? Mhmm. And making sure that when you have those conversation, perhaps this could have been avoided if when the product was being created
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
They actually have those diverse voices on the table. Yeah. And so when you have brought the inside and say, well, you know what? Actually, Latinas women, they actually have more curls and more body Mhmm. In their hair. Maybe the composition of the product should be a little bit different. Maybe a dark blue tone might not show as much as a light blue tone. Mhmm.
Amy Vaughn:
So
Natasha Pongonis:
A little nuance can really make a different impact, and it comes back again to having those diverse voices, diverse data in the process to make sure that you actually are delivering. I think we all care about the ROI, and the ROI comes by doing the right research from the get go and making sure that you have all voices, all perspectives in the process.
Amy Vaughn:
And, you know, I love this, and I would almost wanna, like, take it and, like, move it into the sense of, like, for mentorship and sponsorship into the way of, like, goal creation and setting. Right? You should make it measurable and be tracking it. So if you have a specific goal, like, put some numbers to it. And as you’re looking at it, like you said, let the data tell the story, and sometimes that can reveal opportunities or blind spots or things that you haven’t been thinking about before. Or it’s like somebody from the outside can look and see. And I think this is also too why I think from a peer standpoint for peer mentors, I really do try hard to have a very diverse number of voices within my peer mentor group, because these women come from different places, different spaces, different experiences in the world, different races, you know, different backgrounds, socioeconomically, all these things. And what’s great is that as I’m vetting things through them, they’re adding that perspective. So I’m not going into the world blind.
Amy Vaughn:
Right? Because they’re seeing the world, you know, in a different way and adding that perspective is always so valuable. And like I said, I like my disagreeable givers. So if they’re like that, I wouldn’t do it that way. You know? They’ll tell me, and it’s so great. It’s so great. Okay. We have got one minute left, and we’re gonna go through our power round questions. Our power round is kind of like a lightning round.
Amy Vaughn:
I’m excited about this one, really just because question number 1. I love this question. What is the best piece of career advice that you have been given?
Natasha Pongonis:
So many. But I think, like, looking back again, and I mentioned that early, is to not be reactive, but to be proactive. Mhmm. That completely changed my outlook and how I start my day.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm. Yeah. Don’t wait for everything to come at you. K? Get ahead of it. I love that. In one word, what is the biggest obstacle for women when it comes to mentorship or sponsorship?
Natasha Pongonis:
You know, I think it is just perhaps, having that lack of understanding of what you want the journey to be. Mhmm. Sometimes it’s like, you look for a mentor to help you figure that out. But you know it starts with you.
Amy Vaughn:
I love it.
Natasha Pongonis:
You need to have a vision of who you wanna be. Mhmm. And then have a mentor who can help you Oh,
Amy Vaughn:
That’s perfect.
Natasha Pongonis:
That vision.
Amy Vaughn:
Yeah. That is that’s gold right there, Natasha. Because I think that’s the difference between a mentor and a coach as well. Right? A coach is gonna coach that out of you. They’re gonna work that out of you. You’re gonna go through a process with them, and they’ve been trained and skilled to do that. Whereas, like, you’re right. A mentor, you’ve gotta have that vision.
Amy Vaughn:
You’ve gotta have that goal, and you’ve gotta be able to have them to help you go for it. Alright. Last one. Finish this sentence. The key to effective sponsorship is?
Natasha Pongonis:
The key to what?
Amy Vaughn:
Effective sponsorship or mentorship. We can take both of them.
Natasha Pongonis:
This is your network.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm.
Natasha Pongonis:
Yeah. It has a rich, large network.
Amy Vaughn:
Mhmm. Yeah. I love it. Thank you so much, Natasha. This was really, really fantastic again. So many amazing, brilliant, helpful pieces of insight
Natasha Pongonis:
and information. And, anyone, feel free to reach out. And, you know, I always open my network, your senior network. So if I can make an introduction, even though I might not know that person, in person, but Mhmm. Always happy to make an intro.
Amy Vaughn:
Fantastic. Where should folks find you?
Natasha Pongonis:
Super easy. My name, Natasha Pongonis, and all my social media tags are at natasha pongonis or m pongonis. So you can find me on Instagram or LinkedIn.
Amy Vaughn:
Awesome. Alright. Folks, I encourage you to do it. She put it all out there. You know? Time is of the essence. Be proactive, not reactive. Look. I got, like, all your sayings down here.
Natasha Pongonis:
I just know
Amy Vaughn:
this beautiful list of all these great takeaways. Thank you so much again, Natasha. We appreciate it. Alright, friends. That is all we have for you today. I hope you enjoyed it. We are gonna be on a 2 week break. I’m gonna miss you all.
Amy Vaughn:
Next week, I am actually, like, taking off to the mountains for a little bit of r and r before we go into our national conference week. So, yeah, we’ve got a few busy weeks ahead. So we’re gonna pause recording for 2 weeks. I encourage you to go back and listen to some of our amazing past episodes that we have. We have 3 seasons now of just amazing content like this to help you grow in everything and your career personally, professionally, and all things digital in life. Until then, we will see you soon. Everyone, keep asking, keep giving, and keep growing. Take care.
Amy Vaughn:
Bye.
Natasha Pongonis:
Bye.
