Full of Herself

Amy Vaughan

Welcome to our weekly Power Lounge, your place to hear authentic conversations from those who have power to share. My name is Amy Vaughn and I am the owner and Chief Empowerment Officer of Together Digital, a diverse and collaborative community of women who work in digital and choose to share their knowledge, power and connections. Join the movement at wwwtogetherindigitalcom. Let’s get started. Today, we’re going to be discussing why a woman who is full of herself is the most beautiful thing you’ll ever see. With the book author full of herself, Sarah Moore, Sarah is a wealth of empowerment and wisdom and women’s leadership coaching. With over a decade of experience, she is a trailblazer who guides women to discover their true desires and muster the courage to pursue them. In her book full of herself, she shares personal stories, insights and practical tools to empower women on their journeys, fostering a sense of confidence and fulfillment. With a unique approach to the creation of the transformative pump-up sessions which we’ll talk about today, Sarah’s impact extends beyond coaching, leaving a lasting impression on those that she guides. Welcome, Sarah, I’m so excited to have you here with us today.

Sarah Moore

Oh, thank you, and I love this forum that you’ve created. It really feels like being in community, which is, I know, exactly all about. So thanks, Of course.

Amy Vaughan

Of course, yes, we love being live with our listening audience. It always kind of helps it feel a little less like we’re just talking between ourselves, because, again, it’s about the greater good, it’s about the community. You’ve got some amazing wisdom to share, sarah, but first I would love for our listeners to learn a little bit more about your career journey up to this point.

Sarah Moore

I’ve had so many twists and turns and I’m really proud of that. I recently maybe in the last couple of years started mentoring some folks from the university I attended in England, the University of Sheffield and one of the questions I get all of the time from these young women is well, how do I know if this is going to be the right decision for me? And I always say you don’t right, you really don’t. If it’s the decision that makes the best sense for you right now, then I think there’s something there worth pursuing. And so when I tell them my story, every decision I don’t want to say every decision, almost every decision was really born out of an interest or passion or some sense of purpose. So I’ve worked in the editing field for a local newspaper. I’ve worked in lingerie because I couldn’t find a bra that fit and I thought there was a real niche in the market. And I’ve worked in oil and gas and I’ve taken time off to travel extensively. And these are just examples of something in my brain that piqued my curiosity and, not knowing at the time, I really just had the courage to walk down those paths. Hang on, I can’t tell you, amy, how those experiences primed me so well to become a coach. So, for example, when I worked in the editing world, in journalism, my job was to tell the stories of local business owners. Well, I couldn’t have even imagined at that moment in time that I was going to become a owner. I couldn’t imagine that. And then I didn’t know I was learning so much about entrepreneurialism that was going to set the stage for when I became one myself. When I joined the lingerie company, I quickly realized I was in the business of changing women’s lives. Well, guess what? I’m now in the business of changing women’s lives. So I just love this idea of being able to attend to the ideas that are in our head and giving ourselves the space to explore them and make them important. And so many die right, and they die pretty quickly. And also there are a handful that keep our attention, that have certainly kept mine and took me in directions that I’m really excited about, that I walk down.

Amy Vaughan

So, yeah, that’s just a little bit about how people yeah, I’m so glad we asked that question because I think a lot of women tend to find a twisty, turny sort of journey in their career as a negative jumping from one thing to the next, taking a gap year and all these different things. But yeah, we don’t consider it as something as a cumulative amount of experience that actually should lead towards confidence in the fact that we’re working towards finding our way and our purpose and our value and our most valuable gifts that we can bestow on others so that we can end up where we’re meant to end up. But if you’re not willing to explore, if you’re not willing to be courageous, if you think you have to stay the straight and narrow, how are you ever meant to get there? So I love, I love, love, love your perspective on that.

Sarah Moore

Yeah, I think it makes for an interesting life Absolutely, and we want to look back on our life and describe it as interesting or adventurous or something along those lines, and I think what we’re saying that’s even bigger than that is that we lived in alignment with what was true for us. So I think that when we give ourselves that reign, we get to craft a beautiful story.

Amy Vaughan

Yeah, I’m kind of curious. So I don’t know if we talked about this before, but I lived in England for about two years, in Oxford, and you’re from the UK and I think I mean maybe I’m generalizing, but I do feel that it’s a very American thing to think that our life and our purpose is our job. And it was interesting when I lived overseas so few people started kind of when they first met me. They didn’t ask me what do you do for a living? Whereas I feel like here stateside, as soon as you meet someone, like the first thing you want to know about them is what do you do for a living? Do you agree? Do you disagree? Do you feel like it’s the same kind of all around?

Sarah Moore

I agree with you, and I’ll also add a caveat that I was raised in the UK and I left when I was 22. So I’ve never adulted. I’m 40. So I’ve been 18 years. So my adulthood has been shaped by America, and so I am a little out of touch with that. However, the way I would describe it is in England. For me, there feels like there’s more of a train of thought that you sort of work for the men. We’re a very classic society. You sort of choose a lane and you sort of work for somebody else. Of course, there are lots of people doing it differently, but America is the land where everything, everything is possible, and I love that about America, even though I think we also overindex on it. And I too have had to retrain myself. I’m still retraining myself to ask a much better question than what do you do? What one of my favorites is Tell me something you’re excited about right now. I love that. That’s a good one, and I even have to catch that little thought in my mind that says you sound weird asking that question, and yet I’d much rather know something that you’re excited about. Yes, and starting to measure myself against you, which is unconsciously what do you do, then creates a space for Am I above you, am I below you? 100%. It’s just insidious.

Amy Vaughan

I agree, I agree, I agree, yeah. So let’s all do that. Let’s start practicing. What are you most excited about? I love that. I’m excited to be able to share with you something that you would normally get out of just a general conversation, especially, like you said, because of that comparison, which I mean comparison. We’re talking about confidence today. Constant comparison can definitely be a big trap in your confidence and not feeling confident because you’re constantly comparing yourself to others. But let’s talk a bit about well, I mean again, a part of getting into confidence is overcoming self-doubt. I was wondering if you could share an experience where you overcame self-doubt and were able to start to embrace your full self.

Sarah Moore

Great question. I’m a real fan I’ll sort of set the answer up this way I’m a real fan of paying attention to the tiny moments in our lives. We tend to focus on the big ones, right. Those could be anything from a career change to getting married, falling in love, having a child. It’s a little bit like we’ll focus on buying a really expensive outfit for a big occasion that we wear once. Yet our everyday clothes are what we inhabit and we have the most relationship with. Yeah, just like our tiny moments are. So if we aren’t very practised at paying attention to how we’re thinking and feeling and behaving in ordinary moments that are happening repetitiously, we don’t have a great chance at being able to catch our behaviour or our feelings in the bigger moments and then being able to pivot. So I’m going to share a tiny moment of self-doubt, and it actually involved having my hair done, and it was just a few days ago. So I had a consultation with a gal. I was looking for a new hairdo and we walked through everything. I thought we were on the same page and when my hair was finished, it was absolutely not what I wanted. Oh no, yeah, and I’ve never had a bad haircut before, so I could.

Amy Vaughan

Lucky 40. How many years Exactly?

Sarah Moore

So I’ll continue, feel the emotion rising and I know that we can all joke about you go. You know how do you think your hair looks. I think it looks fine. And then we go home and cry. I told our truth and so she asked me so excitedly, what do you think? And I said I’m really not sure. I said this isn’t the colour I was hoping for, nor is where the colour began, what I thought we agreed on, and I also don’t love the cut Right. And so that was a moment of self-doubt. Do I just eat it and agree with you, or do I actually speak up and say, hey, this isn’t something I wanted? And we’re all faced with this moment constantly. Do I lean in or do I pull back? Do I trust myself enough with my voice and my ideas, or do I think what I have to say isn’t important enough? And so I chose to lean in and, by the way, feeling full of myself didn’t feel glorious, right, it felt awkward and I was sad and I was disappointed, and I was also experiencing a sense of freedom because I did say what was on my mind and then I was able to step away. I was able to call the owner of the salon and fill her in on what my experience was. It was what I would label a difficult conversation. I was kind, I was also firm and I was able to come back together with this stylist and we were able to work through it. And my mother-in-law I live here in Ohio, lives in Texas and she is a trainer. Her stylist fears and I called her for advice in the interim and she said something that really stuck with me. She said if you feel you can work through this together, you might actually have a stylist for life because you overcome some struggle together. And that really stuck with me, because how quick are we to not face the difficult moment and hack our bags and then there’s potentially not always, of course just a wasted opportunity to be able to work through that. And there’s a coach and consultant I trained with a few years ago. His name is Fred Kaufman and I learned a lot about difficult conversations from him and something that Fred told me I think about constantly and it’s there aren’t any difficult conversations, just conversations we don’t know how to have.

Amy Vaughan

Yeah, that’s true.

Sarah Moore

And I think that’s so much what I’m doing as a coach. I’m teaching the skills to be able to meet those hard moments and close that gap, and that’s also what I’m practicing myself, and so sort of almost a funny example and yet, at the same time, what we can all relate to and a totally across the board right, whether we’re in a meeting or whether we’re speaking with our CEO, whether we’re trying to communicate something intimate with our partner, yeah, just a, just a cool experience that’s left me feeling proud and and follow.

Amy Vaughan

I love it. That’s such a relatable example because I don’t know one human on this earth who hasn’t kind of gone through that experience of someone is asking you for feedback. At the end it’s something like as simple as your hair, which is, I mean, not simple in the sense that it’s your hair. It’s on your head, you see it every day, it’s a part of who you are and if it’s not right, like do you? Actually was just listening. Again, I was telling you we’re geeking out over out of Grant. This morning I was listening to one of his podcasts, rethinking, and they talked about and again I love it to Bernie Brown and her Atlas of the Heart and the number of words we don’t have in the English language to help describe certain emotions, and apparently I don’t remember what the word was now, unfortunately, even though I just listened to it maybe like an hour before, was a word for that feeling you get when you get a bad haircut. It’s this sense of like the disappointment, the shame, but then also, do I say something? Do I not say something? I just thought it was so funny that there’s actually, so apparently I have to go back and look at a pit for you, but there is a word for that. And the other reason I love that example is, like you said, it’s not about the fact that it’s a difficult conversation, it’s just something. We don’t know how to begin that conversation and I think a part of where we tend to start to lack confidence and feel self doubt isn’t because we doubt ourselves, it’s because we haven’t leaned into our own values and when, by you speaking up for yourself and saying this isn’t what I wanted or expected with my hair, you are owning your values, you are living your values, you are living your truth and that allows you again to work through those challenging situations with someone. But also you’re going to find more confidence because you leaned into that. And it also reminded me that some of my most closest relationships I’m going to say it’s like very truthfully because all of them I love, some of the people that I am closest to from a work standpoint are the people that I did not jive with right away. We had to work through some difficulty and then all of a sudden we became that much closer because we had to have a hard conversation. But through that hard conversation, minds were met and trust and respect were established. Because if you don’t just come into it like a jerk and your goal is a win-win and resolution, then yeah, like why would that hard conversation maybe be anything but a positive type of thing? So, anyways, I love that example, Sarah.

Sarah Moore

So much Great. It reminds me of a couple of things I’d love to share. One which is, as we often teach, like a difficult conversation framework to clients, and you just touched on it. The high level framework for what you’re trying to achieve when something challenging is on the table is how can we both win? And at best, what I tend to see this was absolutely true for me is maybe I’m trying to share my point of view in a reasonable and kind way. Right, but I’m still really, if at best I’m doing that, I’m still making it about me, I’m still not taking a step back and thinking about I really want us both to win and that just changes the perspective right. Number one, and I also I love, as part of the framework, that there is a space and a time where we share what our experience has been with the other person, and that part is never over until we have ended by saying and now I’d love to learn what your experience is. Hmm oh yeah, I like just two tangible pieces of information and approaches to bear in mind when we’re entering into these conversations. And the second thing I’ll say, which you also touched on, is the best definition of confidence I’ve ever heard was from CherylSanbergLeninorg, and she describes confidence as three things. One is having a point of view right, so you actually got something to say and you sort of feel like you can contribute to the conversation. Secondly is presence so I’ve got a sense of self right here in this moment, and it can be. I always love to say just enough Like just enough presence. I can still feel fearful, I can still feel I’m not sure, so just enough presence. And then, lastly, it’s practice. So a point of view, presence, and then we just get to practice sharing that point of view in a way where we feel embodied and, to your point, it’s then a learnable, teachable skill. It’s not just something we have or don’t have.

Amy Vaughan

Right, I love it. I love it and it’s three Ps. The writer and me is happy with the alliteration, that’s fantastic. Right that down, friends, if you haven’t already. All right, let’s talk a little bit more about being full of ourselves. Some might see that phrase full of herself as a negative. How have you redefined and empower women to embrace that term more positively? As we can see those who are watching live, she’s got a nice little picture of her full of herself cover behind her as well.

Sarah Moore

Yeah, yeah, I love that it has a double meaning. I didn’t come up with this phrase, it was gifted to me by somebody and I knew it was gonna be the title of the book. And so I think when we think of being full of yourself, it’s oh, don’t be too big for your britches. Oh, don’t be conceited, don’t be arrogant, even literally don’t be full of yourself. And our definition is finding the audacity to love who you are. Right, like that, actually being full of yourself is an act of humility. That’s how I think about it. We’re very trained to talk about either what isn’t working well, so talking about our fears or sort of being on the negative side, or we’re talked to be a little unassuming. Right, you wanna take up too much space? Well, that’s an incomplete story, because there is so much about us, each one of us, that is wonderful and that we have these strengths that are worth sharing, and we know from the research categorically that when we focus on our strengths and we work to them, we go so much further, faster, than if we’re to focus on trying to shore up our weaknesses. Yeah, so, one, it’s important we tell a complete story about ourselves and two, I don’t believe we were born to. It’s not be small, but just to sort of be unassuming and not share the wonderful stories of our lives. And in that sense, I think it behooves us to brag a little, and to brag in a skilled way and to say, hey, can I show something wonderful that happened today? Or gosh, I’m really excited about this. Or even, I love to think about being full of herself as all of our layers. Hey, I was struggling with a conversation I had with my husband this morning and I’m still working through that. I think these are all wonderful full of herself responses to hey, what’s true? Or how are you doing, instead of just staying in this safe, comfortable zone, what do you do? I do this. How are you? Well, I’m good, right, there’s no intimacy in that. So I just love that reframe. And the other thing I’ll add about that is I teach the skill of bragging. It’s something I do in my retreats, which I call public sessions. I teach it to corporate groups, I teach it to my individual clients, and bragging is simply the art of talking well about ourselves. So, as an example, I brag that I have a nice smile. I brag that I’m getting to have this conversation, which is born out of having the courage to do work that I love and keep going, even when it was hard. I brag that I wrote a book. I brag that I really felt my feelings yesterday and took the time to talk with a sponsor and a mentor over something that was hard. So when we brag, when we’re full of ourselves, what it does is it gives permission to other women especially, to do the same. So it’s not just about us, it’s no Than us, and I have watched hundreds of women in a room and somebody gets up and brags and somebody else gets up and brags and what happens is it’s contagious.

Amy Vaughan

Absolutely.

Sarah Moore

I start thinking, oh man, I can brag the same thing, or heck yeah, go you. So it’s really just a gift that keeps on giving, and that’s why I think redefining what full of herself is exciting for us as a team and it’s exciting for the women that we’re touching and working with.

Amy Vaughan

I love that so much. Yeah, I love the double meaning. I think it’s beautiful and, like you said, it’s not about that kind of almost like toxic positivity and bragging. It’s acknowledging all of your faults and experiences. Again, like we started the interview collectively and really looking at it, owning and telling your story in a way that isn’t diminishing or demeaning, because you are, you’re amazing and you have a ton of experience to share. I wanted to say too, as you were saying, you just modeled this so well as soon as we got on, before the rest of our live listening audience joined and before we were recording. You’ll never ask Sarah, how are you? And just get a fine. And I love that. I love it. It’s because it’s so genuine and you kind of just know, as soon as you respond, that I can respond in kind and the same if I need to, and I think, like you said, that that’s that ripple effect. There’s a channel that you would love that our Slack Together Digital Community has, and it’s our hashtag wins channel, and it’s one of my favorites because, even when I’m having a crummy day, I love to go into there and see what other women are accomplishing and I love to know that there is a space for them to be brave and to just shout from the rooftops, whether it be big or small, the things that they have accomplished. Because we’re always so focused on our to-do list and the things that feel and seem big to others versus celebrating, like you said earlier, even the smaller, more, maybe seemingly less significant moments. But pausing and celebrating that’s what keeps you going, that’s what resilience is, is focusing on that positive and, like you said, those strengths versus the negative. So, yeah, I’m so excited I’m getting a copy of your book and reading it. I hadn’t had the chance to yet, but I’m excited too. But, on that note, what was it that inspired you to write Full of Herself, and are there any other kind of key messages that you would want readers to take away that maybe we haven’t quite touched on yet?

Sarah Moore

I wanted to be a travel writer when I was young, hence the journalism move early on and I actually write about this in the book. I realize that my actions and my ideas weren’t aligning, and that’s always a flag it’s not really a red flag, but it’s a flag for me, absolutely yeah. And so I had this dream of wanting to write. I wrote some short stories when I was young, I did some travel writing and I ended up writing a blog. I still write a blog every week. That is probably one of the most successful parts of my business, and because I love to write. And so I just got to a point where I thought I’ve still always had this goal of writing a book. I think I’ve got enough professional experience and personal experience that I really have something to say, and I think the thing I’m most proud of about writing this book is that I really did choose to write it. For me, I’m, by nature, a big thinker let’s go, do all of the things, and so sometimes one of the downsides of that is I can force things into being, and I’ve had to learn so much about the Persian pole. Of that I’m still learning. Sure, I’m as humbling as heck. And so I didn’t write this to get anything or to do. I just wrote it because it felt like it was time for me to do it and I really believe that’s why the response to it has been so beautiful, because I had no expectations. You know, I remember when I finished editing the final draft and I just got in my car and I drove around Columbus and I got my tall decaf soilate, which is the open drink I’ll ever order from Starbucks and it’s like my treat. Yeah, I had the music playing and the windows rolled down and I knew nothing. I didn’t know for sure, but I just had this sense of this is the moment. I don’t know what this is going to go on to do, but this is the moment, and whatever happens is the cherry on top. So it’s been this real gift to me, the book in the way. Lots more I could say about that, but that’s how I got to writing the book. And as for what people take away from it, you know I think about legacy, which is the legacy of the book, the legacy of my life, of no idea what the legacy will be. Also, I think to some degree, it’s really none of my business. I also have a hope that a woman reads it. In fact, I’ll frame my answer this way A lady I know I happen to run into at the library. She read the book and she said to me Sarah, I have so many people in my life and having read your book, I realize that I don’t let people in. I don’t even actually think I know these people as well as I thought I did, and your book is really making me think about being more open, and I’m already doing it.

Amy Vaughan

I mean, that was just, that’s wonderful, what a good feeling, right?

Sarah Moore

I mean, it’s just the most beautiful reflection, and I hope that for women, and I hope that they think about gosh. What does it look like for me to feel more full of myself, which is just being in alignment with the things I’m supposed to be, and walking that path just a little bit more? And then, what are all of those individual stories? I got asked by a local business to do a book club around, full of herself, and it’s going to be in a couple of. I can’t wait to hear, right? So what are some of those stories in your life that you want to tell more of? You want to explore, rethinking, so that could also be your podcast.

Amy Vaughan

I’m just saying, Sarah.

Sarah Moore

Oh, I love that Absolutely.

Amy Vaughan

Co-Hatch is a new kind of shared work, social and family space built on community. Workers get access to workspace amenities like rock walls and sports simulators and more, to live a fully integrated life that balances work, family, well-being, community and giving back. Co-hatch has 31 locations open or under construction nationwide, throughout Ohio, indiana, florida, pennsylvania, north Carolina, georgia and Tennessee. Visit wwwCo-Hatchcom for more information. So, for those of you who are tuning in, we were literally discussing the fact that Sarah is considering doing a podcast, but yeah, I think you’ve got your material right there. I think it would be such a beautiful space to kind of affirm what you’ve been able to sort of put into words and full of herself. And outside of the fact that we’re Starbucks drink twins, however, I will say I usually want to get a little bit of powdered cinnamon on top of my decaf soy latte. It’s like a little marbuji that way, so give it a try. But, as you were describing that feeling, for those of you who couldn’t put yourself in that place in that moment, I will tell you that quite honestly that those moments in time where I felt the most fulfilled are the times that I took the risk and again lived my truest values, owned my story and kind of followed that and then sort of realized in the moment oh, this is that time. Like I am, I’m arriving and it’s such a good feeling and to me that’s fulfillment. And it’s funny because in my past life as a creative director and marketing and advertising I thought that moment would come when I hit a title of creative director and a six figure salary and I didn’t feel anything but empty when I got there. So I can promise you that the fulfillment might not necessarily come if it’s not something that doesn’t align to your values. I used to think that the title and the salary mattered so much. Learned quickly that the case. But yeah, I don’t want any of you, not that I wouldn’t have. I wouldn’t have changed anything because I’m here now for a reason at this time in this place. But yeah, so many years of our lives are kind of spent sort of chasing the sheds of others and I really just again related so hard to your story of that sense of fulfillment and satisfaction. I’m so happy for you, like driving with your windows down, listening to the music, drinking your fancy Starbucks drink, because you did it. You did the thing that you wanted to truly do for yourself, and how often can we say, as women, that we’ve done that? You know.

Sarah Moore

I’d love to say something, too, that I think is really important. We’re talking about being a creative director and thinking that’s the goal. We’re talking about writing a book and I, by nature, am quite full of energy and sort of. You know, I take up quite a bit of space because of that and I’m quite vibrant and in the early days of trying on this full of herself message, I did a lot of women a disservice, of course, unconsciously, because full of herself looks so different, not only for each of us, but also for each of us in all the different contexts we encounter. So being full of ourselves can be having the courage to tell my boyfriend or girlfriend that I love them first. Yes, it can be telling the hairdresser I don’t think I love this. Can we talk more about it? It can be I’m feeling really shy in this social setting and I’m acknowledging that rather than pretending I’m not. Yes, yes, I want to be clear that, again, we have this whole range that we can encounter and it’s an authenticity to the moment about what’s happening inside of us that will always make us feel the most full of ourselves.

Amy Vaughan

Love it, love it, love it. All right, I’m going to develop on a couple of questions here, because my next question and a question from our live listener kind of go hand in hand. As a coach, how do you address common struggles of women feeling that they are not enough in various roles? And no joke, alex didn’t know that I was going to ask this question next, but her question was how do I stop trying to be perfect and not care if I make mistakes? Perfectionism is so hard to let go of, so I’m guessing perfectionism might be on that list of common struggles. So, if you don’t mind, adding to that list possibly, and then maybe giving Alex some insights.

Sarah Moore

Thanks for your question, alex. Let’s start by talking about vulnerability. Okay, so vulnerability is simply the ability to feel. Right, we’re talking about embracing this wide range of emotions that we’re supposed to inhabit and, very specifically, how do we feel in the midst of risk, uncertainty and emotional exposure? Risk, uncertainty and emotional exposure, which is happening in tiny ways and really big ways, right? So it’s? Ooh, somebody said they didn’t like my blog. Ooh, I felt a little bit awkward when I was talking to that mom at school pickup, and now I feel a little bit raw. And what is she thinking of me? These are examples of vulnerable moments as well. As I launch a business I don’t know if anybody’s going to like what I have to say, if there’s going to be any response I’m speaking at a big conference and I’m nervous as heck. These are all, again, just examples, big and tiny, and so we have to practice being able to name and own our feelings across all spectrum, all the way from joy and empowerment and freedom and love to fear and grief and despair and powerlessness and everything in between. And in any moment when we feel uncertain, a little like what just happened at risk and oh my God emotionally exposed, we tend to armor up. We tend to choose not to feel the feelings and put on our armor, and this is part of how we survive. Some of that armor is great. We want to thank it and we need it, and some of it is just absolutely getting in our way. And the three most common ways we armor, up to your question, alex, are numbing behaviors, which we can all relate to perfectionism. And the third is what Brunet Brown calls foreboding joy, which is simply there’s no way it can be this good, I’m waiting for the other. And what’s so cool from the research, I think, is joy is the emotion we’re most scared of. Right, it’s not sad, right, it’s not fear. That’s why we experience something great happening in our lives, and then we immediately think about driving off the road and getting in a car crash, right, right, like, oh my gosh, like the joy is so intense. So we train ourselves to, you know, stave it off. So let’s talk a little bit about perfectionism. Yeah, the lecture said mind blowing being scared of joy, Right, yeah, it’s really unreal. Makes sense, though, how our brains function. Yeah, and it does. So perfectionism is it’s not being super organized and crossing our T’s and dotting our I’s and just having everything. So that’s how we might act out perfectionism, but the actual definition is trying to earn somebody else’s approval.

Amy Vaughan

Right.

Sarah Moore

It’s people pleasing, it’s reading the room. What do I need to do? Who do I need to be? What do I need to say to be okay and meet this moment, so I don’t have to feel the discomfort of maybe not being enough? And when we’re focused on other people, we don’t know that the most important opinion is the opinion we have about ourselves, 100% Right. So let’s let’s talk about I’ve shared a good amount of information there. Let’s talk about two tangible things. When we feel like we’re not enough and perfectionism is riding shotgun, one thing you can do is go to Google or you could also buy a copy of the book, because we have we made a free workbook that goes with the book and this great workbook. Right, this is in, there is get is an emotional chart. Just outlines all of the emotions printed out. Have it in front of you. We also put a whole series of questions around it and just start practicing naming your feelings, because when we’re vulnerable again, under stress, under uncertainty, most of the time we can name mad, sad and glad. What about I’m disappointed? What about I’m irritated? What about I feel completely powerless? What about I’m overwhelmed? It tends to be an easy one for women to say, but just starting to name our feelings, because then, when a hard moment hits and you want to armor up, You’ve got a better shot of staying in the uncertainty and keeping the armor off, because you’ve got language to talk about how you’re feeling. And in fact, adam Grant says this language is the best representation of culture. Well, we’re a culture. You know me myself and I, I’m a culture. How am I talking to myself? How am I speaking? That would be the first thing I would say. And then the second tangible action is if perfectionism is really hallmarked by oh my gosh, what will they think? What will you think? What do you think about me? Well, an antidote to that is what do I think? What do I think? It’s the only tattoo I have and I have it right here. Oh, I love that on your wrist. Yeah, I had a therapist say to me once that the foremost dangerous words in the English language are what will they think? It takes us totally out of our align values, our chart right. Yep, I mean, we want to gather the opinions of others. That’s important to say and feedback is important. But to start saying well, what do I think about what I have to say? What do I think about how my bum looks in this skirt Right? What do I think about what I’m putting in my body? What do I think about what I just shared with the mum at school? And here’s what’s funny is the pushback I get to. That is well, sarah. If I knew what I thought, I wouldn’t feel stuck or I wouldn’t be struggling with what to do next. And that brings us into a whole nother topic which is consistently building in time to pause. Yeah, some kind of reflection practice, whether that’s art or singing or breathwork or journaling or meditation or running, but something that gives us a shot at slowing our mind and body down so we can get to some kernel of truth, even if the kernel of truth is I don’t know. I don’t know what to do next. That’s valuable information because it means there’s still nothing to figure out. We can just get back to the next right thing in our lives and we can wait for sort of a next right action to appear. We don’t just sit back and wait for things to happen. We still have to actively be moving in our life and doing our work. But that reflection alongside of what do I think is a beautiful combination.

Amy Vaughan

I love it. That makes me want to get a what would I do tattoo. Stop asking what everyone else would do. What would I do? I love that so much so, alex, hopefully that was a helpful answer for me. It just sounds like perfectionism is a result of us feeling that we need to be on the defensive. It’s an armor, it’s a way to deflect or delay a sense of feelings and, as you quoted Sheryl Sandberg saying before, a part of confidence is presence, and when you can’t be attuned to your feelings and have language for those feelings and identify them, you can be more present. And then the last thing I wanted to share and add on another podcast, I love listening to and reference a lot outside of Brené and Adam. I mentioned that my first name because of course, we’re all great friends not really, but someday, parasocial relationships, there’s our thing. Right, we can do hard things with Gwana Doyle. I was on a while. I used to love listening to when the weather gets warm. I’ll get back to it. That was my going for a walk. Treat was listening to. We could do hard things because I felt like I was in a conversation. I wasn’t in the room with them, clearly, but just listening to the things they would discuss. I always felt like I was a part of a conversation, and one of my favorite things that literally made me stop in the middle of the street and just kind of stand there for a moment was when Glennon said it is not your business what everyone else thinks of you. I was like, oh, thank you for that, it is not your business. No, not your business. What everyone else thinks of you, what everyone else thinks of you, is none of your business, and I, honestly, it is a mantra that I have leveraged over the last few years because, again, this was mid pandemic I’d go for a walk and listen to those ladies. So, yeah, definitely a great piece of advice. Lots of good stuff there. All right, so let’s get to our next question. Let’s see where are we? Oh, we’re going to talk about. We kind of I feel like we might have touched on this one enough to love who they are, without fear and judgment of societal expectations, and we’re kind of coming close on time. I think we might get some more questions from our live audience as well. So I’m going to skip ahead a little bit and talk about analysis, paralysis, because this is a real thing. Uncertainty can definitely be the cause of analysis, paralysis. How do you guide women to identify and pursue what they really want? Because that’s how sometimes half the battle, half the battle right is figuring out what you really want with courage.

Sarah Moore

Hmm, courage another learnable, teachable skill Can’t have courage without vulnerability, right. So without sort of some bandwidth for uncertainty, risk and emotional exposure, courage cannot exist. And also part of courage as a skill is living by your values, right, that’s another building block towards courage. And I really think that when we intimately know our values, which really are our guideposts for decision making especially in the dark, in those hard times where you think what we’re analysis, paralysis may be a part of the problem If we don’t know what those core values are, it’s so much harder to make a decision with clarity, which is the key piece, not just a decision right, a decision with clarity where we know it, we feel it, we think it, we can trust it. We don’t know if it’s going to be quote unquote the right decision, we just know it’s the next right one for us. I. So I really believe values work and it is so key to being able to have a sense of clarity and confidence and so much values work is rubbish. I’m just going to say here here’s a list of values. Choose a few that make sense to you. No, I would really encourage you to get with a coach or a mentor or someone who can walk you through some really intimate values work. So you’ve got that with one or two core values. You can’t have any more than that, and by them successfully. The research has shown this really clearly. So for me, their faith and courage. So if I’m in a situation where I don’t know what to do, I’m trying to think. If I can pull up a real life example, because I think specifics are so helpful, let me think, sure, right. So I was faced with a decision of my own, doing around, not being as far along as I wanted to be in my business. That’s why I’m going to share it for right now. Maybe there’s a more true way of saying it and do I continue to try out some things that I’ve been thinking about? Or is it time to hire a coach, a business coach, that could help me get over this hump? And I was really going backwards and forwards and I felt like I was tormenting myself. And a red flag for me around analysis, paralysis is if I’m thinking a lot, then I need to do something differently. Excuse me, I even have on my notice board here. Life is so much easier when I make decisions with ease. So I’m looking for ease in my decision making and I know I need to take my foot off the gas if it’s feeling hard and I’m going around in circles. So, in this situation, I’m going around in circles and I’ve got all the pros and cons and blah, blah, blah and I just came back to my values. Right, I think myself. What am I most scared of? I’m scared that I’m making an excuse, for I’m just making excuses that I need a coach, I need somebody else to pave the way, when really I know what to do Right. And then, as I started to look at that excuse a little bit more, or what seems like an excuse, I’m sorry, a reason a little bit more clearly, I realized I’m not making excuses at all. I’ve done everything. I know how to do. Now I need to practice what I preach, which is bringing somebody alongside of me, a partner, hiring them because I think they have all the answers or this will be the golden ticket. I’m hiring them to learn, to invest in myself, to become a better CEO, woman who’s running this business, and I really don’t know where that’s going to take me, but I do think it’s worth the investment. And so, as I started to look at the reasons and the fears, I knew I wasn’t pinning my hopes on somebody else. I was actually. I was doing it for the right reasons, and so that then aligned with faith, faith in myself and the courage to take a new step. But if I didn’t have faith and courage, I don’t know what I would measure that again. So I think values is a massive part, and I also think analysis, paralysis, which we could also describe as procrastination, often happens in the absence of a dream, sort of thinking, maybe a little small, a little too analytically, and we’ve sort of we’ve, we’re in the weeds, rather than being able to step back and say what’s the bigger picture here, how will this really serve me on a bigger scale, and I think that can get us in touch with again something that’s more true, which begets some clarity.

Amy Vaughan

I love that. That’s such great advice. It’s funny you mentioned the pros cons and I wrote that down before you said it, because I think in the past I mean as far back as high school, right of me and a friend of mine anytime we had a big decision. That’s the first thing we did Pros cons list, you know, and it’s really more focused on what you think the outcome might be, and that means you’re not necessarily doing it for the right reasons, you’re just doing it because you think it might get you to a desired outcome. The other thing I think that puts me in that spiral, or has in the past, is a lot of times I think less about even prox cons and more about what will the perception of others be? You know, and am I making this choice to present myself differently than you know how I am currently, and so the perception of others might go into a lot of my, you know, second guessing or doubting or just not making a decision. And then I think also, you were getting at those, those self limiting beliefs. You know the things that we kind of tell ourselves over and over and over again that we, you know, we can’t do. Again, focusing on, though, the weaknesses over the strengths, but I could definitely see how you know again, I agree with you find somebody to do the values work with. We’ll definitely drop Sarah’s coaching information into the show notes and all that good stuff so you can reach out to her as well. But having that, you know, that clarity gives you so much as a person. It gets you out of that rumination, it gets you out of that analysis, paralysis. It also gives you boundaries, right, because when things start to come your way and you evaluate it and you know that you’re already tapped out, you can say no because you know it doesn’t necessarily align with your values and where you’re heading. So such such great advice Okay, we’ve got about four minutes left. I’m going to ask you another question and then also just leave it to our audience one more time. Give you all the gentle nudge. If you’d like to ask Sarah a question, you are more than welcome to just drop it into the chat. Now, sarah, let me see. Oh, I promise we talk about the pump up session, so I’m going to go into that question. Could you tell us more about pump up sessions and how does it help women reset their thoughts and quiet that lovely internal chatter that we all get to deal with day in and day out.

Sarah Moore

Yeah, so I’m in the business of talking, right, and I think, essentially, talk, therapy, talk, talk, talking is a wonderful way to work through what it is we’re thinking and want to change, and it can’t be the only solution. Now I want to be very clear if you have a therapist, a coach, somebody you’re talking to keep doing it, you need it. You need it. It’s super important and we don’t live here, right? In fact, I just heard Mel Robbins this morning say this so succinctly that one of the things she’s learned from her podcast that was the clip was five things I’ve learned. Right, I love that. Yeah, I’m about to borrow that now. Right, was that? Everything about my mental health is from the neck down. So I started seeing and even experiencing for myself that, as somebody who is highly functioning, also struggles with perfectionism and therefore, over things that sometimes talking isn’t my best friend, I’m giving myself a headache. I can feel it. I’m, you know. So how do we engage in our body, how do we engage our bodies in the process? And our emotions live in the cells of our bodies.

Amy Vaughan

Absolutely.

Sarah Moore

But when we move, that’s why we can feel a change in state, and so I had this idea of how could we create a coaching session that almost felt like a workout, right, and it really it, it, it, um. Also what I’m looking for, it, uh, it became something different, slightly different, over over time, and I think about it now as more of a spiritual experience, and something that I never intended but became a really important part of the session is the pacing, right. So, before I say that, so in a pump up session, we are dancing, we are doing some breath work, we’re journaling, which you know, the act of writing is engaging our bodies, we are sharing intimately, we are walking if we’re doing it live, we’re walking red carpets and letting women kind of take that moment to shine. Um, we’re doing sort of all sorts of different activities, and the pacing of all of it became this really important ingredient that I landed on by accident. So maybe we start off by breathing slowly, we’re listening to some music, and then we immediately turn it up and we start like pumping it up and shaking and doing some jumping jacks, and then we bring it right back down and there’s a journal prompt and we’re journaling, and then we’re sharing and, and so this thing created just an incredible change in state, because we were doing the work, but we were doing it in lots of different ways and it’s just become this really transformative experience. And I do a good amount of speaking, and what I love to do most when I speak is share a pump up session with a team or a group of women especially. I’ve also done it with men, and um had one great compliment from a big real estate company down in Texas and they said I feel like we did more in an hour than we’ve done in two day conferences, that we did it, and I don’t know if it’s as much as that, but the point being that because of all of these different modalities, we really move the needle much quicker on. Some of it is healing and awareness that I that I think is truly magical and it’s fun and we get in community with one another.

Amy Vaughan

That sounds like so much fun, so we might have to have you do that for one of our events at some point, because it just sounds like a blast.

Sarah Moore

I’d love to.

Amy Vaughan

It, you know, and it’s so sad, but I mean we do live in very much a society and I remember hearing a talk a while back at the 3% conference and talked about how like sitting is the new smoking. It’s so detrimental to our health the amount of time we spend sitting. But it’s like also the physical, like that is the physical, but the mental impact of being so sedentary as well. I think sometimes we forget to be in our bodies and it kind of it makes me wonder why. But I didn’t even know what possessed me. But at the start of our national conference last October I was up on stage and I just remember, you know, you feel like you’re in your body or in that moment I’m being aware of how I’m feeling, which is a little bit, as Glenn and Doyle would say, skited, which is scared but also very excited, and I’m like I need to do something. I can’t stand up here stiff as a board. And I kind of felt the energy of the room was a little bit low. It’s morning, people are getting their coffee and it was kind of a dreary ish day to start, and so I asked everybody to just do the wave and I said we’re going to start on this side of the room and we’re going to do the wave all across and it was just so funny, just a simple act of people asking people to stand up for just a moment together, put their arms above their heads, sit back down how the room shifted and how the energy changed. So I can only imagine, if we go full on pump up session, what that could be like. And I am just finally learning, at the age of 40, which is good, you know, it’s the best time of any probably to learn that how much movement really is medicine and helping you get out of your head If you are kind of that person very much in your in your head a lot to get into your body more. So that’s such fantastic advice. Sarah, I could probably keep you on here for a whole another hour to talk more, because I even had like two or three questions left. We didn’t have any additional questions come through from our audience, but I know you ladies have been listening, so thank you for your comments. Thank you, alex, for your question. As I said, we’ll be sharing Sarah’s contact information so you all can reach out to her. What I should just ask you, sarah, what are the best ways, or preferred ways, for our listeners to connect with you.

Sarah Moore

Our website mooresoulsessions.com. We’ve got everything there Link to the blog that people really love, which is a great free resource where we’re talking about what does it mean to be full of ourselves, what does it look like to totally miss the boat, as well as practical coaching tools, and then the link to the book is on there, etc.

Amy Vaughan

Fantastic. Thank you so much. All right, oh, alex did sneak in one more question. Oh, the link will get you the guys, the link to buy the book. I’ll drop them in the notes, in the show notes and then also in Slack. We’ll get this for you all. But thank you so much, sarah. This has just been wonderful, really energizing, very encouraging. I hope all of you felt the same that are listening today. Hopefully we’ll see you all next week. Next week, we’ll be talking about branding with one of my favorite brand specialists, kate DeLeo, who owns brand trifecta. I met this gal at Content Marketing World and I’m just like guys, it’s just going to be high energy. I’m just going to warn you, we’re going to talk fast, we’re going to nerd out about all things branding and, yeah, kate’s always got some truth bombs to drop. So I hope that you join us. Thank you so much for being here today. Thank you again, sarah. This was an absolute delight and I hope to see you all next week. Until then, keep asking, keep giving and keep growing. See you next week. Bye, everyone.

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